I make Sex Toys
Hi My name is Wayne I make sex toys. for a living. Yes.
How is that not a great way to start a conversation? Great for parties!!
Not only do I make sex toys, I make sex toys that give you electric shocks!!. I'm the creator of E-Stim Systems, an award winning UK company well known for being different when it comes to the world of adult play.
Join me as I explore the hidden world of making sex toys, the ups and downs of working in an very interesting industry, and the ins and outs of using our products.
I make Sex Toys
Market Magic and Ethical Crafting in the BDSM World
Join us as we welcome Shaun from Leather Delights, a family-run business with a passion for high-quality bondage gear.
From their roots with Andy, the legendary Kinky Cobbler, starting back in 2002, Leather Delights grew into a beloved name in the BDSM community.
We discover the importance of events like the Birmingham Bazaar Bazaar and the London Alternative Market, where Leather Delights offers customers the chance to feel and appreciate the tactile quality of their products as well as sharing some heartwarming customer stories that sparked new product designs.
The journey of expanding Leather Delights' online presence while nurturing community connections through market events is filled with highs and lows, and Shaun shares some intriguing insights.
Ethical considerations in the world of BDSM are paramount, and we dive into the responsibilities of manufacturers and sellers ensuring product safety. We discuss the dangers of using potentially harmful objects and the importance of consent and control. Personal anecdotes illustrate the significance of ethics and safety, while we explore the innovation behind Leather Delights’ product development, from their humble beginnings to the playful experimentation that shaped restraint products.
Drop us a message, we cannot reply directly but it would be great to here from you
"I make sex toys" is a the personal podcast of Wayne Allen, the Director of E-Stim Systems. The content of these podcasts are not designed to be Explicit or Erotic but we may discuss adult topics and therefore these podcasts are not suitable for children or those of a nervous disposition. You have been warned.
If you are interested in E-Stim Systems the company, or any of our products, have a look at https://www.e-stim.me/buy
Hello everyone. It's Wayne here from iMakeSexToys and we're in the eSteam studio and I have a guest today. For change, I've actually managed to cajole someone to come in and talk to me, so I'm not in here on my own. I have here Sean from Leather Delights. Sean, would you like to introduce yourself? I think you've just done it for me. So yeah, my name's Sean from Leather Delights. I've kind of been making bondage gear for what? 13 years now, and the business has been going since 2002. It's not too bad 13 years and doing bondage gear, and he's just about managed to untie himself.
Speaker 1:But we first met sean. In fact, he would have first met sean's dad at, uh, a place called bbb, which is the birmingham bazaar bazaar, which, if any of you are not in the UK, bbb is an event held in a city called Birmingham, in the middle of the UK, and it's quite well known in the UK. It's a fetish fair, which is why it's called Birmingham Bazaar Bazaar, because it's in the UK. And Sean's dad, andy, was known as the Kinky Cobbler because, guess what? He was a cobbler and he did kinky stuff. And that's how we first met. And do you want to carry on the story? Oh yeah, so dad started the business back in 2002 at the bbb. He's where he first traded um, in fact, this month october, but I'm going to scan out, but october is our birthday month and then, sadly, he passed away 2011, at which point me and my mom carried on the business without my nan. So since then, it's been a real family business skull for strength. It's true. It's just gone from there half the accident, really. So how, how many bbb's have you missed? Uh, so the business? In total, we've missed two, and one of them was two in two in 22 years. Yeah, two in 22 years. Yeah, we've done in 22 years. Yeah, we've done a lot. I think we counted about 250, 216 total we've done.
Speaker 1:And you do other events as well, don't you? Yeah, so we do the LAM, which is London Alternative Market. That's held, obviously, in London each month. So we've done all but two of them as well, and they've been going since 2004. So, yeah, we 2004. So, yeah, we've done 200, all of those done. It's got to be 250 events myself since I started helping in. Well, I started helping in 2007, just by carrying boxes upstairs for dad and then doing everything really since 2001 everything, yeah.
Speaker 1:So why do you do the events? I mean, what do you find about events is the key for you as a business. So for us, the key is being able to talk to people face to face, and bdsm is very tactile. People want to pick up and fill items before they purchase them. So it gives people the opportunity to pick up our paddles. See all the different textures we've got.
Speaker 1:So there's more than just leather. We've got some rubbers, we've got some furs, and then, with collars, example, you can try them, see what size you want. So they're all made to measure. Likewise, with cuffs, we also do some made-to-measure harnesses. So it's just an opportunity to get people to come try stuff on and, you know, get a feel for what you're buying, rather than just buying blindly off the internet and hoping it fits. You still have a web through the web, absolutely yeah. So you can buy from our website as well, and everything comes with a lifetime guarantee. So, like yourselves, lifetime guarantee.
Speaker 1:I wonder where that idea came from, but yeah, so if you ever break anything you buy from us, we'll repair or replace it, depending on, obviously, what needs to be done. But we are probably going to ask you how you broke it, partly because we want to know. We normally need some me an interesting story. Oh, an interesting story. It is here to protect the innocent. Of course, crikey, I wasn't expecting this one. No, I wasn't. I'm trying to think what to say for YouTube. Oh, for YouTube.
Speaker 1:So it was probably one of the guys that purchased a chest harness office. He just kept breaking it and we just couldn't figure out why. And we found out he was trying to do some self-suspension off a rope frame. It's never a good idea, in my opinion. Essentially, what happened was the D-ring kept pulling off the front and that essentially led to his changing the design. So the design put the D-ring behind the lever rather than just kind of clicked on the front so it couldn't sit. Now, if you're going to do the same kind of task, instead of pulling off and the rivets pop in, you've got to rip through the lever, which is so you can use it for suspensions. Yeah, I mean, I'd advise not to. They're not necessarily designed for suspension.
Speaker 1:So you do harnesses, yep. You do pedals. You do collars. What else do you do? Probably in the majority, but we also do some floggers. We've got nipple clamps, we do a few belts. That means spikes down high spikes. Lots of spikes Obviously leads to go with the collars. We've got some cock cages and blindfolds. Those are actually quite extensive. Pretty much anything you'd associate with bondage and leather is. Some people may. Like I said, we make it to size as well.
Speaker 1:So is it just leather you work in or do you work in other materials? So primarily leather. Obviously, the kinky cobbler probably gives away. Our background is in the shoe repair industry, so a lot of the rubbers we've sourced from there White and impactful. Without intending to, I think it means they hurt. Yeah, they hurt like hell. And obviously all the rubbers have got different textures on them, which gives it's a completely different sensation based on the texture. And then we often pair them like a rabbit fur on the reverse, so you'll get a paddle that's nice and stingy on one side and then nice and soft and sensual on the other. So essentially you're getting two for one in a single paddle.
Speaker 1:You mentioned fur. Yes, now fur for a lot of people is quite controversial. Yes, because they like the fact that we're using animal skins. I mean, I think leather is probably quite controversial, but from a fur perspective, what's your thoughts about using fur? We put a lot of kind of working behind the scenes to work out where our materials are coming from. So we speak to a lot of suppliers to check their sources.
Speaker 1:All of our leather and fur comes as a byproduct to the meat industry. So we don't buy anything that is killed for the purpose of selling the fur lookalike I mean coats and something like that. It's something we would stay well away from. So the rabbit fur comes as a by-product to the meat industry. We do it in nice different colours as well. To which Don't? They say this when I haven't seen the pink rabbit? Yeah, well, they don't like to fail on this either. See the pink rabbi running across? Yeah, but obviously people like the colours, so we offer a wide range of colours as well. Rabbit fur is probably the most controversial because people have it as pets. Don't worry, no, bunnies were hurt, we were eating them instead. Yeah, so I totally understand that, and each to their own really.
Speaker 1:Likewise with leather, it all comes as a by-product to the meat industry and it's all sourced from UK suppliers and we can kind of trace that to where it came from. Are you considering sort of going into the markets of things like aviga leather and leather substitutes, because we know there are people out there who have issues with leather. Yes, so we've looked and we keep looking. There's a few out there. We've tried cork leather recently. Actually Wasn't a massive fan of it it didn't I don't know. It just didn't quite feel right, didn't feel like it was going to last up to any kind of punishment, so we kind of scrapped that off pretty quickly. We've tried a few over the years and just never felt like it would be light. Yet Doesn't mean it won't in the future. And now we're putting the ship into it.
Speaker 1:It's something that I mean the whole concept of recycling and ethical sourcing. I mean we've had issues with recycling. I mean we've gone from using plastic tubing which was virgin, for want of a better word to recycled and recyclable tubing for our electrode cases. Even that was quite difficult to find something that actually was consistent all the time, didn't smell like strange bin liners because a lot of recycled plastic smells like bin liners and actually lasted a reasonable amount of time. Because we don't want our tubing to degrade because it's used to protect our electrodes, but equally we want it to be environmentally friendly so we can chuck it into the recycling and it be recycled. Then, of course, we use large quantities of aluminium, which is a very recyclable material, even more so than Coke cans. I mean solid aluminium like these. Our recyclers are sitting there going. Please send us the offcuts. We're recyclers and we'll give you money for them, which is really quite nice.
Speaker 1:What do you see as your future in terms of things that are changing? I mean, we're seeing the markets have changed. We no longer do the markets. We started off doing the markets. We did BDB, we did LAM, lff, etc. And we just got to the stage where we were so busy doing normal orders, normal production, that we couldn't do the markets because it took up a Sunday, and that was before things like social media came along. So do you see any major changes coming up in terms of how you operate at the moment? How you operate at the moment? So, yes and no.
Speaker 1:I think increasing our online presence is key for us. That's definitely an area we can expand. There's, as you say, there's a market scheme from around the UK, so you've got BBB and Lamb, but there's also plenty of rules now popular around the country. That is kind of becoming a little bit congested, where there's almost too many events to sustain people and they're kind of spreading what is, I wouldn't say, becoming a little bit congested, where there's almost too many events to sustain people, and we're kind of spreading what is, I won't say a small charity, but a smallish community. We're kind of spreading that a bit too thinly around the country.
Speaker 1:Perhaps I think also we found because we did a few markets dotted around we did bristol and we did a market which actually is the infamous market for us, because it's the only market we ever did at the time where we didn't sell anything at all because there were six people turned up. I remember we did an event in Cardiff and we sold one item all day and there was probably only a dozen people. Yeah, this particular event I'm not going to name the, it was a coastal town in Kent, I'm not going to name it. It was a coastal town in kent, I'm not going to say exactly which one. Basically, for quite a few years this was the only event we'd never sold anything out and literally six people turned up. It was the organizer and his friends and it was like, okay, fine, that that's the luck of the draw. That's what happens when you run a bit in the business and then actually was it a bbb? A couple came up to us and said we saw you at this event and we've come to buy a box. And it was like, oh no, and that means we no longer have an event in which we haven't sold anything Because technically they saw us at the event and now they're coming to buy it from us. Now it was like we've never done an event where we haven't sold anything at all.
Speaker 1:But we did a few events dotted around. We did Brighton Pride, cardiff Pride, we experimented and we love doing events because you get to talk to people. The problem is a lot of the time it's the logistics. We're based in Watford, you're based in the middle of Tamworth, the middle bit, the middle bit, and, yeah, sometimes the four or five to get to somewhere and then you've got to unload, set up for the event, do the event and do the whole thing. Bang, it's a slice. So yeah, I mean London for us.
Speaker 1:We get up about 6 o'clock in the morning to get there for about 8, half 8, doors open at 12, then cruise about 6, and then by the time we've gone home. It's you know. I mean hopefully. Have you got some pictures of your stand? Yes, I shall put some pictures of the stand in the podcast and if this is the audio podcast then you need to go and look at the video version to see the pictures. But we'll try and put some pictures of your stand.
Speaker 1:But your stand isn't quite compact. It's a proper stand with lots of things on. Yeah, probably takes a few hours to put together. It does so between me and my mum. It takes us anywhere between two and three hours to set up. Depends on how many sets of stairs we've got to do up. Note for the event organisers could we possibly have lifts that work and not a lot of stairs and things? You know, next time you build a venue, no stairs, be brilliant with all of that box with varro as a van and we fill, stop nothing to you good idea stuff. It's demo organised and just stuff. In England we've got plenty of boxes. Yeah, so it's.
Speaker 1:I can remember our times of doing events and yeah, it was. I don't think we ever got to a van level. We had a big car. Yeah, doing events was quite a squeeze sometimes to get things in and then you forget the trolley and people would be like have you got a trolley? He's like the trolley. Who's brought the trolley. But yeah, we enjoyed doing the events. It just got to the stage where we couldn't logistically do them. What's your favourite events? Oh, I'm going to call you a fic on record, can't I? So officially you should say I like all the events. Yes, I was caught up with a politician's answer. So I think each event we do.
Speaker 1:Bbb has been around for 20 odd years. Bbb has been around before us, yeah, so BBB's got a nice venue, nightingale's in the centre of Birmingham. It's a spreader of three floors. It's quite well established. Now you've got quite a good local scene that you can attend on a regular basis. So that's quite nice. It's nice and open and, you know, very welcoming the scene, very friendly there.
Speaker 1:Lamb is probably another market. At the moment it's in a cocktail bar just outside Covent Garden because it used to be the bank at one point, didn't it? Yeah, so it was Revolutions in London also, just, and we, when we used to do it, when we used to do it, it was in South of the River. Yeah, in an old theatre, yeah, but yeah, the fact that they get established venues means that you get that element of it. It's more consistent. Yeah, as soon as you get an event where they've been kicked out. The management don't like what's happening. Yeah, so with events in the past, yeah, bbb's been at Nightingale since it started, so 20 odd years and it's been through a couple of renovations as well. It has. Yes, can't use the stage because we're painting it. Remember that year? Yeah, not always to the better. They blacked out the windows one year, which wasn't great for a market, but, you know, probably pretty good for a night job. Yeah, lamb has recently changed venue. After nearly a decade it's last venue.
Speaker 1:So I'd say lamb is probably a great experience, a great day out where you can go and sit with friends and have a nice meal. Do they still have the after parties? And they yep. So both of them have got an after party and they start about an hour or so after the market closes, so it gives you time to go out and get food and get changed. You know, take you staying nearby and I don't know what time they finish. It's been a long time since I've seen them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, as a vendor, it's that I just want to go home. Yeah, I don't want to go and play now. Get some food and put your feet to the ground We've had in the past. We've invited to events and we have done events which have been play events, and they're like, oh yeah, you can come and sell some things and then you can play. And it's like it's really difficult to mix the two because one minute you're thinking about okay, do you take a credit card? Yeah, I'll take a credit card. Where's the signal? That's always the classic one at an event, and then it's like I'd love to be spent over that spanking bench or hanging off that cross, but and then sometimes I'm like I've just bought this off. You Can I? Just I don't know if one of these for a gag is like I can't answer any questions. I can't say anything. Sorry, what's the weirdest request you've ever had? Oh, weirdest request, I don't know. Actually, I don't really consider any of the requests. We can't. Okay, what's the most extreme request? Possibly one that you've had to go back and go. Are you sure? You probably start to get to the realms of some of the spanking equipment and some of the puddles. I say this going.
Speaker 1:He's going to mention spikes. I am going to mention spikes. It's a really bad idea to put spikes on a puddle knowing I've got spikes at home ready to put on a puddle of this weed. We have a standing joke about spikes. Spikes are something that crops up in a lot of conversations. Just taste spikes. We've had people ask for all sorts on puddles. Where you look at it and go, that would cause some serious hell on my end. Don't think that's wise at all. So you're looking and yeah, no, I'm not sure we want to touch that. Yes, I think I mean we.
Speaker 1:We've had some interesting um ethical issues, shall we say we, we had a, a customer who once um said that they they wanted to use one of our boxes on somebody's ears in order to create, as they put it, a brainstorm, and we were like that really, really doesn't sound safe. In fact, it sounds so unsafe. The answer's no, I'm not going to sell you that, but you won't know what I'm using it for. Well, the thing is, you've just told us what you want to use it for. We're not comfortable with the idea of you using it for that. We would rather not sell it to you. Yeah, you can go and buy it off the web, but we wouldn't know. But really uncomfortable with the idea of using an item in in such a way that could potentially cause serious damage in our industry.
Speaker 1:Um, shock collars is one that crops up from time to time. Shock collars are a bad idea. I don't care who says oh, it's a good idea. I've been using it on my sub for the last 25 years. You shouldn't bear in mind the iris pca in the uk are attempted to ban shock collars on the use of animals, and the shock collar that's designed for an animal is designed for an animal that has a big lump of fur and skin here to take up some of that shot and you're then going to put it on a human being. He's got really thin. That is the skin around here, two massive sets of nerves around here and you're going to give them quite strong electric shocks. And you wonder why we think that might be dangerous. Mmm said yeah, we don't recommend shock collars. It's one of our pet hates.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you do have people out there who will take things to extremes. I've seen people saying that they're going to use barbed wire for whipping or barbed wire for tying someone up. Doesn't feel right to even have that discussion with them because it's just so unsafe. And yeah, if you're using impact instruments of any description, I know that a skull ruler can cause a serious amount of pain. It's a piece of wood this long. What happens when you get a big batch of some description? And we've seen people selling thick aluminium bats. I've seen the barbed wire based on butts as well, people selling them. Just yeah, I'm sure I want to sell that. Some of the toys we sell are designed to hurt. But two kinds of pain you want if there's like the pain you want from an impact toy. And then there's the ouch. This is really sharp. It's just cut me, get away. I really didn't.
Speaker 1:I think the difference is it's down to control, yeah, and it's down to having a dom who has the ability to control themselves and control the instrument. So let's face it, you've got cutting tools that you use to cut for leather, which are very capable of chopping fingers off, oh yes. But you, as an experienced artisan, know how to use those tools in the correct manner, and that's the key with impact instruments. It's the key with easton. Once you know how to use things and know how to use things in the correct manner, they can go from something that's massively enjoyable and for other people, pain can be enjoyed, um, but the difference is it's consenting and it's control and it's pitched to that level that, okay, it might take you to your limit, but that's your limit, and it might tickle a little bit further. But for a lot of us who have those experiences, that's what you want. But it's still, it's under control and it's with consent.
Speaker 1:It's not just a oh yeah, here's a cane, bang, bang, bang. And we, unfortunately, within the industry and within the fetish environment, you do see people that think that using a cane or a paddle is literally just pick it up and hit someone with it. They have no idea where to hit or how to hit or how to use that in a central way that their subject gets that level of feeling and sensation they're after, rather than just I've just been beaten up with a big stick of wood. It's nice to know that there are people out there who are not just making the stuff to sell or look, I made it, you buy it. They're out in the story. But there's some ethics behind.
Speaker 1:What are you going to use it for? How are you going to use it without having that element of the nanny state? Let's face it, the nanny state was around. We'd never be making anything that hurt anyone. Oh, that's bad, but this comes from the 50s, when we all beat the children with the canes. Never did me any harm. So I'm told the personal, the personal. So we're going to get all personal now.
Speaker 1:Now, one of the things that we pride ourselves on in eSIM systems is all the sales team and in fact a lot of the staff use our kit. So I'm going to be personal. Do you actually use any of your kit yourself? So I hope my mum's not watching now, but, sorry, my earlies. So yeah, over the years, obviously we've experimented with various bits and pieces that we sell, like the cuffs, collars, paddles, smugglers, etc. And you know less so as you get older and you start their family because we have a more difficult. Yeah, it's like mum, why is the door shut? I want it, mum. Mum, why is the door shut? Shh, go away. I'll be back out in a minute. Your father's busy, yeah, so it kind of boils down to that. We wouldn't sell anything that we wouldn't use. So you know, we'll try stuff out and see what they feel like, but yeah, not as much as we used to use.
Speaker 1:Do you have any particular favourites? For me, it's probably the cuffs. I find the cuffs really comfortable when we're at the events. We get people to try them on, see how they feel what. What we're looking for there is to make sure it's not going to cause you any pain in a way that you don't want. Obviously, you want to be restrained. You want to feel the restraint. You don't want it to be digging in under your wrist, for example. So I think the Cusp we do are really good, really solid. That's why we do the Lactone Guaranteed because we know they don't break.
Speaker 1:Probably one of my favourites, which are basically really long belts with holes from top to bottom. Use some really cool things with them. So, like you look for full body wraps, so around the arms, quite quickly, it's only good you do with rope. It's only good you could do with these just finished wraps. Just a little bit frustrating, because I've never really got on with rope. I've always found that it's quite sort of it's easy to mark. Yeah, you then end up with un-picked knots, and there's probably knots that people do that. I mean I just put a granny knot in and it's like it doesn't tighten. Yeah, I just didn't have the patience. No, and I mean talking about belts.
Speaker 1:I remember Andy actually created a particular belt that you could use as a waist belt, but there was an extra bit in it wasn. There was which allowed you to do like a figure of a wrist restrain. Have you got one? I've got one there. You can take it off, though, oh god, you could spend as close as you want. Live on camera, live on camera. So this is the ultimate in actually. So this demonstration. I've had this belt for 13 years, okay, so this belt was one that he made, which is so the very first event I did. I took it off his shelf and put it on, and I've not took it off since. I've been through like airport security with this on, and nobody's ever quizzed me about it, but it works as a standard belt. And then, for years and years, I looked at some of the other head cameras. Yeah, I did my show.
Speaker 1:So, basically, what you're going to do, the two nudes I hope you can see that. Okay, it goes from being a belt that you wear and trimmed a set of cuffs like that. So you've got wrist cuffs there, and obviously you can then put it around like a chair leg you're trimmed into to, you know, around the neck potentially, if that's what you're into. So, yeah, that was a design he came up with and that's actually been one of our best sellers. So someone's now going here and going, oh, I'm going to copy that. There's plenty of people that are copying it. You'll find it all over Etsy, but I think he might be one of the first to do it. I'm not sure. It's only the first time we saw it.
Speaker 1:It was one of those things that you go to events and lots of people do paddles and cuffs and collars and things like that. That and this, this belt, was the one thing that stood out. It was different, yeah, and one of the things that we always like about businesses and and try and emulate and for us, it's something that we try and do is that elements of always being different? If everyone else is doing cuffs, then you need to do something. Yeah, okay, you can still do cuffs, but either do different cuffs or do something that's different, and this was something that always struck my mind, because I mean one. I do own one. It's somewhere at home. I should have gone to the owl. It was just completely different to what everyone else is doing. 20 odd years later, I still remember it. Yeah, you're still saying it to me.
Speaker 1:What I like about it is it's a really simple design. It's actually got two uses. So, yeah, works on your jeans. You know when your jeans come off, you've got to set a course for it to go and hopefully airport security won't notice. Yeah, although every time I go through it I've got a tent belt off, tent shoes off, thank you. Then you start walking. Yeah, but what about the three dildos? In my case, we don't care about. Shoes are more important. They could explode. Yeah, we've taken some interesting stuff from airport security, including these.
Speaker 1:You did it on purpose or we did a show a few years ago and this is before Brexit, because now if we do shows, we have to ship everything out through customs and do carnage and things. But we did a show Actually. No, it wasn't a show. We were going to see Mr B to do some demonstrations and we had a flight case. Strange enough flight case I'm currently sitting on because I don't have a seat.
Speaker 1:I'm sitting on a flight case just to do this and we had to carry a load of kit with us and Rob was doing the whole thing. He was like, yeah, we'll take it through, and I had a load of these. I don't think I had the decimator. Actually, I think I had something smaller, but the funniest thing, kaz was going through as well and she got pinged because she had M&Ms and they were like getting the wipes out, looking at the chocolate and going, oh, it's going to go through the ion scanner. I'm sitting there with, yeah, I've got like things that look like bullets and bombs and things like, yeah, no problem, whatever.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, yeah, we've taken a few interesting things through customs before, let's face it, people take our kit on holiday, play in a nice hotel room or on the beach or something, and things like this. I mean that's great because it does allow you to sort of play even further. And playing, I mean knowing that you're walking around with a set of cuffs around your waist, it's quite an interesting idea. Yeah, so I wore that every day to work when I worked in an office, and nobody ever asked me a question about it, nobody even looked at it. And I think I mean these days, I think there is more. I mean we've played in public sometimes, we've.
Speaker 1:I remember a date we went to Pizza Hut and I had cuffs on and these were quite fortunately, they weren't your cuffs, they were the other company, but they were quite wide leather cuffs and I think I might have forgotten I had them on. But we went into Pizza Hut and we were having a pizza and suddenly realised that I've got these two leather cuffs on, but because they're just there, they look almost like an arm bracelet. So it's that okay. Yeah, we're here now, we're paying the bill and the waitress couldn't really care less. But yeah, walked into pizza wearing two bondage cuffs and nobody noticed.
Speaker 1:This about is always one thing that's always stood out for me, from Andy and Kinky Cobbler and there Yourself is Never Delight. So hopefully we're going to see more of these ideas, because it's a really good one and it works At the end of the day from a playing perspective. That's what we want. Yeah, it's that. Does it work? Does it do what it's supposed to do? Doesn't do what it's supposed to do? And will it last? And will it last? Yes, unfortunately, there is a large amount of material out there. We see it in the Eastern world. We see it in the adult world in general, where there's still the adult tax, where people they buy something from B&Q and so the price has tripled or quadrupled. It's like you bought that piece of rubber tubing from B&Q and you're now telling me that it's bondage and therefore it's five times the price. Or they purchased it from my pet hay, china or India or Pakistan and it's been made by someone who probably gets paid $3 an hour.
Speaker 1:You pull it and it falls apart. I mean for me, for restraints, for cuffs and things like that. I want to be able to pull against them. That's the whole point about being in restraints. I want to be able to pull them as much as I can. I don't want things snapping, I don't want things breaking. I want it to restrain. It's supposed to hold you, which is why I don't like things like pro, because I just end up damaging this. I've got nerve in a hand doing this.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I really like that. It's a treasure. What have you got? Again, it comes back to that. It's unique. Yeah, it was. It's certain things you remember certain people for yeah, I mean I've solved loads of these just to people I know, not even at Martin's. Yeah, just out the back at the pool and they're going oh, my god, and it is that. It's something that's different. It stands out and because, really, after 20 years, I still we do genuinely have one. Just we've got so much kids at home, I don't know clue. Half an hour, it is okay, so, okay.
Speaker 1:So when did you and Kaz first join the scene? It's probably a good place to start. Oh, that's a question. When did we first join the scene? Not to date you to a way, wow the scene.
Speaker 1:We predate Easton slightly, but separately, because we effectively came together as the concept between Easton was being created, which is where Kaz really is. Would Easton exist without Kaz? No, the ideas might have cropped up because I was thinking about them, I was going to munchies, I was talking to people before Kaz was around. In fact, I actually met Kaz at a munch. If Kaz hadn't been as involved at the beginning, then, yeah, the company wouldn't be where we were now, because I was lucky enough to have a partner who said let's try this, let's play with this.
Speaker 1:And you know we enjoyed playing with our products. That's how the first products came about. We enjoyed incorporating into play, so we did things like the a box, which uses sound. That was based on playing events with spanking and bondage, where there was music playing so you would spank, or came in time to music. That then expanded into using headphones so you could listen to your own music rather than to listen to the some dj playing some weird stuff. You could listen and play to your own music and that's where things like the a box came from. And then we have remote control. Again, I experienced that as her controlling and she experienced it's me controlling. So we were sort of experimenting before we met in our different ways. We then met at a munch. Then we got together and things just progressed from there. And the nice thing about being in the industry we are certainly at the beginning we still have the opportunity to play more publicly.
Speaker 1:The problem we had with that is you'd be playing and someone would want to ask you a question about your products, which was like my mindset is in this, this subspace, but now you want to know, or can I place an order? And like I'm playing, please let me, let me just? And it destroyed any ability to play in a public space, like a club or fetish fair after party that sort of thing. So we sort of moved more into the private play, which was the big change for us, out of interest. How did andy get into it then?
Speaker 1:But the story I'm told is young friend who brought him a pair of cups and said, can you repair this for me? And he basically just said, no, I'll make something better. And a couple of months later he was at the BBV and that's quite a quick. That was it. And just a friend saying can you make something? And he did. And then he was like, oh, I'll show you where to sell it. And that was that. And 20 odd years later we're still here. It's history, exactly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think we've run out of questions. I think I've run out of questions. I didn't bring my little iPad. I managed to leave that in the car, but I think we've done. We've had some interesting conversations. We have, yes, and I'd like to thank you for coming on as my first in-house live stream podcast guest. First of many, first of many, and next time I might get the cameras in the right place. I think we might have to do another one, but yeah, it's been great having you.
Speaker 1:Thank you for coming and good luck on the rest of Leather Delights and I'll put some links where I can for Leather Delights, get some free advertising anyway, if you like what I'm doing and trying to do here on. I Make Sex Toys or even East Sim Systems, because that's actually the main business I do, then please consider ticking on the subscribe button which might appear down here, if I can get it to work, or if you're listening to on the podcast, then maybe leave a review. If you don't like what I'm doing, please consider leaving a review, because then at least I know that you don't like what I'm doing and I might be able to change it. But whatever you do, please be safe and have fun. Have fun and thanks for listening. Please be safe and have fun and thanks for watching. Bye, yeah, and that's how you do a podcast. I forgot to press record. I'm just kidding.
